Pushing Through Discomfort to Achieve Success

with Amber Deibert,

Performance Coach at Amber Deibert Coaching

In this episode, Pete is joined by Amber Deibert, a performance coach for Enterprise AE’s who want their mojo back. During this conversation, Amber and Pete combat challenges sales professionals feel through imposter syndrome. The two talk about working through issues of failure, identifying your differences as strengths, finding the way you work, and the adversity it takes to push through the uncomfortable to achieve success.


Key topics in today’s conversation include:

  • The biggest challenge in hypergrowth for sellers (2:28)
  • The ripple effects of imposter syndrome for sales professionals (7:09)
  • Making your differences your strengths and finding your superpower (15:21)
  • How the current economy is impacting sales professionals (23:07)
  • Identifying the secret power of how you work (27:23)
  • Final thoughts and connecting with Amber (30:12)


The SaaS(ramp) Podcast explores how tech leaders scale from product adoption to enterprise success. Learn more at www.saasrampmedia.com.


Pete Thornton 00:06
Welcome back ramp to The SaaS Ramp Podcast. I’m your host podcast Pete, an amazing guest on today, brand from a former organization even. This is Amber Deibert at Amber Deibert performance coaching, a performance coach to the stars to elite sellers. That is welcome to show Amber.

Amber Deibert 00:23
Pretty soon I’m gonna get a star. I can’t wait. No, honestly, this is totally tangential. I would love to be a sports psychologist. Like sports, I feel like there’s so many ties into sports and sales. And I just like any connection I can make. I’m like, how do they do it? That would be my, the stars would be my athletes, that would be a dream. No, that that’s

Pete Thornton 00:46
very closely tied in. That’s why all these books get so popular that they are like those in the military or sports. And all the sellers are like, Yeah, but if you cut their legs out from under a minute discovery called notice. All the things like good correlate over so so well. Yeah. So maybe a quick background. Amber is the first sales enabler that I met long ago. And I was like, Oh, that exists. That’s amazing. And then she branched out, created this business, enhancing performance for elite sellers. And I was like, Oh, that exists. That’s amazing. And then I usually wait three years, and now do whatever Amber.

Amber Deibert 01:27
I’m so on here today. Honestly, I’ve been so excited to have this conversation with you. It feels so fun to like, come full circle. So for those of you who don’t know, as Pete and I worked together, he was a seller in the sales organization. And I tried to poach him to come over to sales enablement, because I was like you have everything it takes. You’re an amazing teacher, you’re an amazing seller. Like you’d be so amazing at sales enablement. So it’s so fun. Sadly, it did not work out but not at the right time. It’s so fun to see how much you’ve grown and how you really have fallen into what you are so good at, you really are like using your superpowers every day. It’s so awesome to watch

Pete Thornton 02:04
It is so fun and so good. Yes, thank you. The encouragement was amazing. And that was back when we were in person. So I actually got to meet you like it was more than a zoom tile, which is good enough for now, since it’s been so long. And it’s like some of the things you talk about. Because see it on LinkedIn, we’ll be able to see some of these things on social media. If you follow Amber on social media, you’ll be able to follow these along with these things too. But there was a different world then then in software. And so we have quite a different environment afterwards. So there’s a couple of topics that you touch on that I would love to unpack for the audience today. And the first one is around this challenge that we’ve experienced in hyper growth in general. And then in the economy at large. But I don’t know, without kind of giving too much away on intro style. Will you let us know what the one thing you’ve been talking about for a number of years for these elite sellers has been and kind of like the challenge that it solves for?

Amber Deibert 02:56
Yes, it’s imposter syndrome. And for those of you who don’t know what impostor syndrome is, I feel like it’s kind of a buzzword these days, people, most people know what it is. But there are other people still who are like, I didn’t know, that’s what it’s called, like, I didn’t know that there was a name to how I feel. So for if you aren’t familiar with what it is, imposter syndrome shows up in three different ways I call it there’s three different flavors to impostor syndrome, the first flavor is that you feel like a fraud, you feel like you’re making all of this up, you don’t know what you’re doing, people are gonna find out. And then you’re going to be let go, they’re gonna come in with a spotlight and be like, we found you out, you’re making all of this up like you’re out of here, the jigs off. The second flavor of imposter syndrome is that you feel like you just got lucky, which I’m sure so many of your audience can relate with. You feel like you were just in the right place at the right time. It wasn’t necessarily anything that you did. You just happen to like, get the promotion and be there at the right moment to like being where you are. The third way that impostor syndrome shows up is downplaying all your achievements. So you feel like there’s not really anything special about you, anybody could have done what you did. And it’s not really that big of a deal that you accomplished what you did. My favorite example of this is a person who literally got a PhD in rocket science and was like, No, anybody could have done it now that pigs take off.

Pete Thornton 04:12
Well, you guys,

Amber Deibert 04:13
like it shows up at all levels.

Pete Thornton 04:14
That’s wild. That is wild. And when you pose you’re always saying that this is like a high performance issue. Yeah, more so than anywhere else, which is the most ironic thing but maybe like, you tell us the audience for this, like, Who are you speaking to nine times out of 10 with this? Yeah.

Amber Deibert 04:32
So the only way that you can have imposter syndrome is if you’re a wild success. Like if I could burn anything into people’s brains. It’s that you cannot feel impostor syndrome unless you’re successful. You only feel impostor syndrome when you get your next promotion. You got the next project, you got your new role, you’re at a new company. impostor syndrome only shows up when you’re in a growth phase. It will not show up when you’re in your comfort zone. People who are competing are sending their jobs and not looking to grow. We’ll never feel impostor syndrome. Because imposter syndrome only shows up when you’re learning a new skill. So of course, you feel like a fraud, you feel like you don’t know what you’re doing, because you’ve never done it before. Of course, you feel like you’re making it up because you are making it up. But also, it’s really helpful to notice that impostor syndrome is fleeting. It’s a passing phase. It’s not something that exists. So Pete, like, I’m sure for you the first time that you were cold calling, you felt like a major impostor, you felt like, I have no idea what I’m doing. What am I like? This is so uncomfortable. I’m not meant to be here, they’re gonna find out that I’m making this all up. And then you did it hundreds and hundreds of times, and you no longer felt worried or nervous about cold calling. The same thing happens for your first discovery call, the same thing happens for your first training, like the first time that you’re doing things, you’re going to feel like an imposter. And that’s totally normal, because you’ve never done it before. But the fact of the matter is, as long as you keep taking action, the imposter syndrome cannot last. It’s inevitable that it’s going to dissipate. But what’s really interesting for your audience, is that people who are in hyper growth mode, I will talk to people and they’ll say I’ve just felt impostor syndrome like this killing like this crushing impostor syndrome. I’ve been feeling it for my whole entire career. And I’m like, without knowing anything else about you. I know that you have been promoted really quickly in your career. And they’re like, oh, yeah, you’re right. Like your trajectory was a lot steeper than other people’s, if you feel a lot of impostor syndrome. So for a lot of your audience, they are in that hyper growth. They’re constantly pushing their stem cells outside their comfort zone. They’re constantly growing, you’re constantly learning. And so it feels like imposter syndrome is this problem that they have that they’re carrying with them? When really, it’s just a matter of like, they’re doing a lot of growth very quickly.

Pete Thornton 06:45
Yeah, okay. Okay. So that does make sense, especially for our audience, like, these are hyper growth. SAS sales leaders, mostly, like super ambitious, will drive themselves on and then find themselves or put themselves in organizations that are just being just propelled so quickly, over these past few years, just shuttling into, you know, into orbit as it were, or like if you call them a rocket ship company, I mean, that’s the metaphor, the visualization for a reason. So maybe you could talk to me a little bit about like, the ripple effects of that on an individual if they’re feeling the three things you mentioned, like if they’re feeling like a fraud, or feeling lucky, or downplaying their achievements, because like, this is something that they’re actually experiencing this hyping this up imposter syndrome, then like, what does that how does that show up and like otherwise, day to day work?

Amber Deibert 07:38
I think for a lot of people, they use it as evidence to back up their beliefs that they have about themselves. Like, I believed that I wasn’t cut out for it. I believe that I’m not meant to be here. And here’s the evidence, like now I’m feeling like an imposter. And I’m like, that’s just proof. It’s proof that that’s true. I should also point out that, along with being in a hyper growth stage, causing impostor syndrome, there are a few other things that cause impostor syndrome. Number one is that you feel like you’re the odd one out, if you’re a minority, people don’t look like you people aren’t aligned to the same as you, you have a different background than everybody else, I can’t tell you the number of top top performing sellers that I talked to, they’re like, well, but my I didn’t come from a typical sales background. So I don’t fit in, I don’t belong here. So everybody has some way of feeling like they’re the odd one out. So I know so much about imposter syndrome, because I experienced so much impostor syndrome. And for me, it was that I grew up in poverty. So it’s like, people are gonna find out that I’m actually this girl from nothing. And that I’m not supposed to be here in the San Francisco tech startup. That’s a rocket ship. And like, I just got promoted to manager for the first time, like, they’re gonna find out that I’m not supposed to be here. So I think people use it as evidence to like, continue to believe what they believe about themselves, whether it’s, I’m just not that confident. Or I’m not supposed to be here, or I’m not that good. Whatever it is, they use it as evidence, and then it becomes not. So the way I like to, and I’m kind of probably jumping ahead here. But the way I like to think about impostor syndrome is that it’s just like physical growth. So let’s say you switch workouts, and you’re feeling really sore after the workout, your muscles are feeling sore. We don’t like to notice those sore muscles and think, Oh, I really suck because I’m sore. Right? That discomfort is evidence to us that the workout worked. And impostor syndrome is exactly the same thing. Imposter syndrome is a little bit of discomfort. That is a reminder to you that you’re right in your sweet spot, because being complacent sounds like the worst thing ever to you.

Pete Thornton 09:43
Okay, okay, that’s interesting, like it does and it does like, it does kind of sound like that if you’re otherwise driven, because like there might be some things that are leading to some you’re not taking action as much you not feel as confident in some of these sales roles where some of these interactions like confidence could be helpful. But what you said, to go back just a minute of like using it as evidence. So funny about that. And just for your example, you mentioned poverty. So your example was poverty. But if you were doing super well, and I’m imagining just other people in general, like books, I’ve read rags to riches, I’m even better, because I started further back and things like that. So like this evidence is just you can manipulate it however you want to manipulate it. So it’s interesting my background in teaching, like teaching. So

Amber Deibert 10:30
As you say, you have this, like, I don’t come from a traditional sales background, but whoever has the argument, please point to me what a traditional sales background is, there is no major in sales period, everybody comes from a different background.

Pete Thornton 10:41
You didn’t read the room, you had all these at bats and things like that. So that was definitely there, you’re gonna have to give around like, that was reinforced by the way of taking 25 resumes around like, you know, and trying to get the next job like we value your teaching and like, Thank you. Can I have your introductory level position? I? Absolutely not. Yeah, I appreciate it back to Science for me. But honestly, at that point, like if you can use that evidence and spin it a different way. So now, I’m probably getting ahead of myself. Because if these things are evident in so many people that are moving so quickly forward, and then and you can’t really be feeling any of those kind of like those symptoms of unless you’re actually you know, a hyper achiever in these hyper growth arenas, or wherever you happen to find yourself, then then, like, the mental construct, how do you take that and flip it like awareness? Sounds like it’s one of them, like, no, your store muscles, hey, that’s probably evidence you’re doing well. So if people become aware of having these feelings, and knowing that is an indication of this imposter syndrome, and it means you’re moving ahead quickly, so I would assume that would be the first but any anything more to say on that would be Yeah,

Amber Deibert 11:52
It’s all about reframing it. So every single High Achiever you’ve ever seen, has experienced impostor syndrome. And it’s so crazy to hear the ones that talk about it. I’m trying to keep a list but so far I have liked Maya Angelou, maybe you’ve heard of her. Jodie Foster, an Oscar award winning actress JLo probably heard of her. Billie Eilish, Conan O’Brien, like literally any successful person who has gotten to that level has had to push through a lot of discomfort, and has had that impostor syndrome. And it makes perfect sense, like you’re doing something you’ve never done before. Of course, you feel like a fraud, but you’re gonna keep doing it until you learn how to do it. And then it’s no longer going to be a thing for you. So first of all, knowing that anybody who is where you want to be, has also experienced this, it’s so helpful to talk about it, and normalize it. Like, I think what’s really different about imposter syndrome versus other things is that nobody talks about it. And so it feels like you’re the only one. It feels like you’re very isolated. So first of all, it’s totally normal. Second of all, it’s really helpful to notice kind of like, Why do I feel like the odd one out is because they feel like they don’t have a typical sales background? Is it because I feel like I’m the only one of my race in the room? I’m the only woman in the room and a man full of sales because I don’t have the same experience or degrees that other people have. Notice what those things are. And just like what you’ve done, so naturally, try to reframe them for yourself. How is that actually a superpower? How was that actually, I mean, we talked about sales all the time, like, you have to differentiate yourself, you have to differentiate your product. It’s the same thing. Like if you’re different from everybody else, that’s your inherent differentiator that is going to get you further ahead.

Pete Thornton 13:35
Okay, so that makes complete sense as well. So like awareness, and then a reframe, like reframe, just kind of like flip it on its head, almost think about like, why is this natural advantage? You know, why will you be able to do your job better? Because you have this slightly different? Yes, a slightly different background? Do we already talk about the book range anywhere?

Amber Deibert 13:54
Do we ever know I have it? Do you see it on my bookshelf right there? Okay.

Pete Thornton 13:58
It’s not present. By the way, for you listening, we can actually see each other. So yeah. Awesome, awesome book. And it was really helpful to see somebody bring data to that discussion of like, if you have a variety of potential strengths, then you know, you might actually be able to kind of synthesize them together in more unique ways. Yeah. And the kind of inventiveness that comes from it and like unique skill sets, differentiation, like you call them is really powerful.

Amber Deibert 14:27
I find it so awesome. Because for people like me, who are in poverty, for people who are a different race, and everybody else who came from a different background, what happens is we become so much more observant, because we had to be that way to be able to survive what we experienced. And that is such a skill in sales. You can read the room so much better you feel like you have to be it’s almost like like they talk about fight or flight and I always tell people, if you’re going to give a presentation and you’re feeling that fight or flight response you feel Think that adrenaline is actually really helpful, because it helps you to react on your feet more quickly and see things more quickly. And it’s almost like when you’re in the room and you’re feeling like that risk of like, I’m different from everybody else, it’s almost a superpower because it helps you to be able to, like, more closely observe, like, Are there any saber toothed Tigers on the savanna, and like, be able to spot things and be able to react more quickly. So it really is like a competitive advantage that you have over somebody who has a different background than you.

Pete Thornton 15:30
Yeah, I love that. I do love that because I use that so frequently. I have a stupid story. But I moved down to the coast recently, the coast of South Carolina, between like Atlanta and Charlotte and the South Carolina coast. There is a lot of nothing, like nothing in between. And so when I’m like hanging out down here, or like with more folks who are like from here, I’m the only non big dually pickup truck driver and dude, okay, so

Amber Deibert 15:55
I could tell I mean, maybe you stepped into that identity, it was very fitting for you.

Pete Thornton 15:59
Okay, like, so I fill up my Honda Element, like, great gas mileage. And, and they don’t know anything about technology, because our tech in general is just not their thing, man. He’s a construction worker and likes doctors and things like that. But they’re all just it’s different vibe, this remote world we live in now, and stuff like that. So I’m always like, which of your host trucks is the biggest truck and stuff because I’m staring at all their things which are so normal to them. And they’re like, first of all, they’re like, what’s wrong with you? But second of all, you’re like, why are you observing my truck so intently? I’m just like,

Amber Deibert 16:29
but they’re not doing that, right? Like, that’s not something that’s even like in their slider sites. It’s a superpower that you have.

Pete Thornton 16:35
I don’t know how I’m gonna monetize that superpower in particular, but it shows up on LinkedIn, you’ll know on try. I love it. Okay, that’s really helpful. Is there? Okay, awareness and reframing? Is there any other piece like other actions to take on that.

Amber Deibert 16:51
So I have to give you this analogy, because I feel like it’s very fitting for those who are swimmers. Even if you’re not a swimmer, I think about impostor syndrome being like swimming in a tuxedo, full tuxedo dress shoes, top hat, everything, like you have so much extra drag. And the act of selling is not easy, like swimming is not easy. Like it still takes a lot of effort to swim. But it’s like you’re doing it or even managing one of these hyper growth startups like you’re doing it with all this extra drag, you’re trying to swim through the water, but you have all this drag holding you down holding you back. And I just love to think of it as totally unnecessary. You’re going to feel impostor syndrome, period. There’s no way to eliminate it, because you’re the kind of person that’s going to keep growing. But you don’t have to give it the weight and the like heaviness to hold you down. You can just acknowledge it and be like, oh, man, it’s like sore muscles. It’s working. I’m in my sweet spot. Because the worst thing in the world to me sounds like being complacent and not growing. So this is a sign to me that I’m growing, my muscles are sore, I feel uncomfortable, and it’s going to pass. I’m going to keep doing workouts. And pretty soon this is going to be nothing at all. I find that when I personally like my entrepreneurial journey, I experience a lot of imposter syndrome, doing a lot of things for the first time that I’ve never done before. And I used to like, let it weigh me down and be like, Oh my gosh, I’m the worst. And this is so uncomfortable. And we’re never gonna get good at it. And now when those things come up, I am like, oh, here we are again. Okay, cool. And I kind of move on and it lasts like two or three days, and then I’m over it like, this is fine. We’re totally fine.

Pete Thornton 18:24
Okay, wait for it to pass. No, it will pass those kinds of things. Right. So helpful on that. So hey, what does the tuxedo represent? Swimming in a tuxedo?

Amber Deibert 18:33
It’s the imposter syndrome. It’s like it’s dragging you down? Is it because

Pete Thornton 18:37
you’re trying to put on a little bit of a facade at that point, you’re trying to dress it up, like because you’re like, Well, I have to look a certain way or act a certain way.

Amber Deibert 18:45
It’s just like, buying into the old beliefs that you have about yourself. I’m not good enough, I’m not gonna be able to make it. You had to work so hard to get to where you are now. And by the way, I talked about those three things: feeling like a fraud, feeling like you just got lucky. By the way, with the lucky one, you feel like you just got lucky. And a lot of times it’s like, well, the people who promoted me didn’t know what they were doing. When they put me in this position. They had to be temporarily incompetent. But that also usually coincides with them being too smart. And you’re not smart enough to be around these people. But somehow they were incompetent when they put you in the position. And then the other one about downplaying everything. You feel like anybody could have done what you did. And I love to reframe that as like maybe yes, there are people who could have done what you did. But basically, nobody would have done what you did. They would not have put in all that effort to get where you are. So it’s really helpful to like to see it for what it really is. Yes, you feel like a fraud because you’re doing something for the first time and you’re going to do it enough times that you’re gonna feel comfortable. You know, that’s going to happen because you can see times in the past where you felt like an imposter. And now looking at those skills, you’re like, it’s no big deal. Like the first time you have to run a one on one meeting. It’s terrifying. Like there’s not even anybody else in the room that I can hide behind like It’s just me and like, they can see how much I’m making this up, but then you do 100 of them. And it’s like no big thing. You don’t even have to think about it anymore.

Pete Thornton 20:07
I do love it. Like, because I’m thinking of different scenarios right now. And then I got a phone call where somebody was, this is a leader of a customer success organization, just a friend. And, just like downplaying these achievements, being asked to present on something that will be beneficial to everybody like, this is not worth it, like a presentation is too simple. It’s to this all I do is, boom, and all three of the things started with our I’m like, Oh my gosh, you’re like T and me up from an enablement standpoint. I’m like, all we have to do is I’m like coming into like, you know, they’re given me like alliteration to work with and everything. Yeah, she’s all right. Well, I’ll send you the slide deck. I’m like,

Amber Deibert 20:48
That’s another thing. Like, I think there are things that come really easily to us. And so we’ve downplayed it. But it’s not until you try to teach somebody else to do what comes easily to you that you’re like, Oh, they’re really bad. Maybe this is a strength, it’s really helpful to
lack awareness of those things.

Pete Thornton 21:04
Yeah. Like, maybe things like that. They don’t know how to build a relationship. That way. They don’t know don’t request a meeting in this manner. Like, I just keep it simple. I say these words, I end with a question mark. I’m like, You’re teaching a course right now. You just don’t know you’re teaching it? Because yeah, like because she works for you. And you’ve always done it, stuff like that. Yes. So

Amber Deibert 21:25
it’s finding out what your superpowers are. leaning into those. I have a lot of sellers who were more like strategic account executives. And they’re like, I’m not supposed to be here, because I’m an introvert. Introverts don’t belong in sales. We’re supposed to be extroverts. And I’m like, No way man. Introverts are amazing at relationships. And that has is that is what has gotten us so far. Because you’re not the kind of person who has a lot of surface level relationships, you have a few very deep relationships. And I had a seller actually, that I was working with in 2019. And we were going over this exact same thing. Later that year, he went closed to Fortune 50 companies and had his first seven figure w two years and then went on to do it the next two years, really like getting your mental game in the right place. And making these small tweaks to your mental game makes such a huge difference to your trajectory and where you go.

Pete Thornton 22:17
Okay, that’s totally amazing. And the thing about the introverted sellers, like they make amazing, especially fortune 5100 strategic routes, right, because there’s a deep dive, but those are million dollar deals. Yeah, totally different ballgame. Yeah, they don’t want to grab the mic at the wedding. But no, you know, you leave that to these other Yeah, who’s like himself and market deals all day long

Amber Deibert 22:40
and tell you all about the dooleys. I got jewelry for you.

Pete Thornton 22:45
Two beers. dooleys. Let’s talk.

Amber Deibert 22:48
Yeah, but knowing your superpowers and knowing your strengths, which a lot of times, you don’t know about yourself, because they come so easily to you just assume that everybody can do that. And it’s not until you try to teach somebody else or somebody points it out to you, hey, you were actually really good at this particular thing. Like, it’s worth going and asking other people like, how do i What’s different about me? How do I stand out? Yep, super comfortable to ask them the questions to Oh, my God.

Pete Thornton 23:12
Very insightful, like asking the people around you about those types of things is always very helpful. So that’s a nice, like clean topic, especially given hyper growth. And everything like where we’ve been in the past. I don’t know whether this is for a whole separate episode or not. But like on the topic of awareness, will you just maybe just give us an overview of your take on this economic climate that we’re in like anybody listening later? We’re talking about January 2023. A lot of layoffs in the ecosystem right now. Like we’ll have heard of Amazon, Google. Salesforce had a big one. Everybody seems to have their large layoffs going on right now. So since you do deal with so many elite level sellers, is there any kind of like a ripple effect that you’re seeing from that? Or? Yeah, thoughts on the matter?

Amber Deibert 24:00
I mean, so I deal in, like the human performance side of things. And I’m always thinking about my mindset. And right now, this is a really big drag on a lot of sellers of thinking about, like, what am I going to get laid off? When I was performing, I didn’t quite hit my quota. I’m still trying to figure out this new sales motion of selling remotely versus selling in person, which is what I was used to before. A lot of people also in the great reshuffle switch jobs. They’re trying to sell a new product that they haven’t sold before. There’s a lot of impostor syndrome, a lot of kind of just like that mental drag that’s holding people back from performing as they can. And really what I am focusing on with my clients and kind of doubling down on is, it’s not about working more. It’s about working smarter. I think a lot of people have been kind of stuck on a hamster wheel of like, just being busy and taking a lot of action. And our economy was great. And so you didn’t really have to be that intentional about what you did. You just were able to be successful. And now with how everything is changed, it really takes off being intentional about where you’re going, you gotta get off the hamster wheel. And you’ve got to decide on a destination that you’re aiming towards. So I go through this three step process with my clients. First, we set the intention, like, where are you trying to get to? What are the debts of Disney destinations, we need to anchor you there. And then step two is okay, now you know where you want to go, we need to map out like work backwards, and map out what you need to do to get there. What does your prospecting look like every day? What is your like? How many discovery calls do you need? How many ? And now we know exactly the steps you need to take. This is the part where most people feel overwhelmed, which I think is the number that’s probably like the most rampant problem that people have right now is overwhelm. And overwhelm causes a lot of procrastination, because if I feel like I can’t do it, it’s much easier to just go scroll LinkedIn, or like waste time on my phone or play chess or read the news, whatever it is. So if we can overcome the overwhelm, we eliminate procrastination. And so the third step of my process is helping sellers figure out what their secret sauce is and how they get work done. What are your natural ebbs and flows? What are the things we can do to help those behaviors become automatic, so you’re always doing your prospecting, you’re always doing your, whatever those steps are, that are going to get you to your destination. So being really intentional about where you’re going, mapping out the steps to get there, and then finding the technique that works best for you because you are unique, and finding out that technique to be able to make those behaviors automatic.

Pete Thornton 26:27
Okay, okay, I love this. And I had a conversation only two hours ago with a portion of this. And they’re like, yeah, these are very relevant topics. It’s so interesting. It wasn’t even economic. Like, it was based on your three step pieces that you were putting together. So the first one was like, intention, though, like, is having some kind of Destiny like or destination, like having something out there so that you can aim it. And then the backwards design thing, man, ILO, backwards design is so good. And if you even get the very beginning of backwards design, right, and sales is all you need. All they have to do is click the button and DocuSign if you look at it from backwards, you don’t really have to sell anything. DocuSign like, hey, then this is your correct email. So yeah, two out of three and, and if you’re heading to another organization, and they’ll still pay you on your commission, like there, there can be amazing wind stories.

Amber Deibert 27:19
And code P It’s not about prospecting. It’s about just sending as many Docu signs as you possibly can, like, you’re gonna have a win ratio somehow.

Pete Thornton 27:28
Like, I thought that was Yeah, can you imagine all the horror stories coming out of that, but like, short term, short term wins? And then this last thing, like the secret power, like, how will you work? That is, that’s very interesting, too, because everybody does work differently. And it helps them think through like, well, when am I going to do this? And they started to get into that practical piece of winning a sustainable manner to actually take that action.

Amber Deibert 27:54
So can I tell you my favorite way to figure out how you work best. And I do so many, as you can tell so many analogies of yours, your physical growth is just the same as your mental growth. So I always ask people, What is your favorite way to exercise regardless of whether you’re doing it or not? What is your favorite way to exercise? And I have all sorts of answers from I love doing 100 mile bike rides too. I’m an ultra marathoner too. I’m a CrossFitter, too. I love HIIT training. And I think that the way you like to expend your energy physically should match the way that you spend your energy mentally. So I want you to compare a marathoner to a crossfitter. What’s key for a marathoner is they have to do all the prep beforehand, they have to know what their food is going to be, they have to make sure that their outfits are right, they know what to do with their layers. If they need to take layers off, they know what their courses are, they do all the prep work beforehand. And then when it comes to expending energy, they just do it. And that’s the same for sellers who like to work this way. They need to do all their prep beforehand, and then just crank out the work when it’s time. versus somebody who’s a crossfitter. It’s not so much like they need to do some prep or like, what’s the workout going to be? Let’s lay this out. But they do much better. Operating in like Pomodoro sprints, they do 25 minutes on, five minute break, 25 minutes on five minute break, and they get a lot more benefit from working really intensely for like two and a half, three hours a day, and then having the rest of the day pretty open. So that’s very different, like a marathoner is probably going to spend eight hours doing deep work very focused, we’re getting a lot done, but they have all the planning ahead of time, where crossfitter is gonna work very differently. And I think where people are going wrong is they’re like, Oh, I’m supposed to work. Like there’s some one answer, like, you have to wake up beforehand. You have to have your workout you like whatever. They think that’s the answer, and they don’t match that. And so they think that they’re a failure. Whereas if you just match your natural rhythms and your natural ways that you like to expend your energy. Like Pete, I know you’re a soccer player. For you, it’s really helpful to have a team More around you.

Pete Thornton 30:00
Well, totally. Yeah. Yeah. So interesting. That’s it. So I’ve never heard that before. And it’s super interesting. And how those rhythms could match up and have people understand that, first of all, there’s unique rhythms like that’s Lesson number one in this whole thing, regardless of whether they get past it to their sport. And then so in the soak, instantly customizable to whoever that happens to be so cool. Okay, I have more questions, because like, because you can, because you just could, being cognizant of time trying to keep this thing short is obviously a two parter. So, you know, look out for that one, we’ll get that one on the calendar somewhere along the way. Yeah. There’s programs that you put out, though, and there’s ways that you interact with sellers and leaders. And otherwise, like, will you walk through a little bit of the I don’t know if there’s like a DIY done with you done for you. Yeah, I’m just making these things up. But like, manners, but I’d love for the audience to know.

Amber Deibert 30:56
Yeah. So the best way to follow along with me is to come find me on LinkedIn. I post there every single day, worthwhile content. According to my audience, I’m not convinced because I still have my imposter syndrome. But I think it’s good content. So come find me on LinkedIn, you can find me just search for Amber divert. I also have a digital course you can buy, it’s $150. It’s everything that I teach about mindset and productivity. So that’s a great place to start. If you really want to just kind of dip your toes, I really call that like updating your operating system. I think most of us have a mental operating system that might be stuck in Windows 95. And let’s update it to like, what are we iOS 14, let’s update it to today’s standards and get on to a better bandwidth. So that’s a great place to start. I also do one-on -one coaching with individuals. So come find me on my website. It’s Amber divert.com. And you can get on my newsletter. Find a lot of good stuff.

Pete Thornton 31:45
Yes, yes, indeed. This was so fantastic. Like so many good things within here. So thank you so much for teaching us about impostor syndrome. Kind of works out. Thanks so much for teaching us about things like procrastination and overwhelm. And some of those steps to kind of walk through like mentally walk through. There’s the execution of having to do that yourself. But like, that’s very impactful. Just don’t even have an intention. Start at the end, work backwards and know, back to impostor syndrome that like if you’ve got some of these feelings of like, Look fraud or like, you know, downplaying your achievement. Like the phone calls I get where people are like, this is just ridiculous that they asked me to do this. I’m like, that’s the best thing I’ve ever heard. What’s the problem? Being aware of it, knowing what’s going on? And then kind of just having a method to deal with it. Like these are all very relevant for today’s kind of challenges in the audience we talked to so yeah. Thanks, Amber.

Amber Deibert 32:38
Thank you. Yes, I’m so delighted. I’d be happy. Happy to come back.